This episode is a recording of a presentation I gave on October 6, 2023 about my ‘Sounding Modernity’ project to the XI International Symposium on Soundscape, organized by the FKL-Forum Klanglandschaft in Lugano, Switzerland. See TRANSCRIPT (with a laptop or desktop only) to read what was said.
Introduction
It is October 6th, 2023, in the afternoon. Earlier this morning, I gave a presentation at a conference in Switzerland by the FKL group called Soundsustainability. My paper was about my Sounding Modernity project.
I wrote a script out and published it as a blog, but of course, life changes and I ended up not referring to my notes that much. So, what you're about to hear is a recording (via iphone) of me speaking during the presentation and at the end there are two questions. I didn't get a chance to ask permission to those who asked the question to be recorded, so I won't use it but I did summarize what they were asking me so you can hear my response. And that's it. This is an audio recording of that presentation, which is like what I wrote on the blog. Thanks for listening.
Host
I'm happy to introduce Claude Schryer. He's a Franco Ontarian Sound and Media artist and Arts administrator of European ancestry. He holds a MM in composition from McGill University and was actively involved in the acoustic ecology and acoustic music communities in the eighties and nineties in Montreal, Banff and across Europe. So welcome and you can start your presentation.
Claude
It's about eight o'clock in the morning here in Vancouver. I'm speaking you from the unceded traditional territory of the Musqueam, Squamish, and Tsleil-Waututh nations otherwise known as Vancouver, British Columbia and it's important to do this land acknowledgement to here in Canada in particular, because these are unceded indigenous lands, and we are still working through our relationship with indigenous peoples here in Canada. So, I'm very happy to be here. Unfortunately, I couldn't be there in person. I'll tell you why in a minute. Some of you might remember that a couple of years ago I spoke at an F K L event about radical listening as climate action. And I'm still very much involved in climate action. But what I want to do today is talk to you about a project that's ongoing, an entire year of podcasting around issues of sustainability and sound.
It's a real privilege to be here. And I want to thank Stefano and all the team for your support. I know it's a lot of work, and I know it's late there, so I will be as quick as I can. Also, assume this will be an ongoing conversation. I really like how this conference is about initiating interdisciplinary dialogue that examines the use of acoustic paradigm, eventual or current, with the idea of a sustainable present and future in mind.
It made me think about what do we mean by sustainability? And I'm sure you've talked about it here inevitably because it's the topic of the conference, but it can mean so many different things. Are we talking about assumptions of modernity with sustainability within that framework?
Or are we talking about something completely different? I think it's the latter, but that's something to consider and what about positionality? You know, from what perspectives are we listening? There's a lot of work being done here in British Columbia on positionality and then there's the issue of sustainability in which context? I think we're looking at a catastrophic future. And so that's the kind of listening I'm trying to do.
And it's interesting to be part of this category called Storytelling with Sound because we're talking about, among other things, the ethics of storytelling. And of course, ethics are very complex. Are we talking about the truthfulness of information? Are we talking about appropriation and social justice? Uh, we're probably talking about all those things, but for me, ethics and storytelling is about telling, um, the truth and avoiding those fictional tales about ex endless growth and exp and exploitation and, and some of the myths that we've created that are highly problematic.
So, I'm really interested in, in further exploring this idea of ethics and storytelling and storytelling in particular. So, uh, like many of us, during the beginning of the pandemic, we were stuck at home. And I'd just gotten back from a conference in, um, Arizona, the creative leadership course that Julie's Bicycle did. And I was thinking of starting a podcast and, and I just accelerated my work. And I started a podcast called conscient and I did a hundred episodes in a short period of time because I had the time, and like many of us, we were at home. And so, I got to know a lot of the issues that I'm working on through conversations with individuals and experts and then I decided to do an art project. I said, well, how can art, how can sound art actually contribute to these issues?
What is the impact of art? And, and of course, I ask everybody these questions. So, I decided to, to give myself the challenge of doing a five minute episode every week for a year and so, I have been doing that. Some of them are longer than five minutes. But the idea then is to look at how sound art specifically can serve as a medium for not only environmental awareness, but for facing reality. And speaking of facing reality, I've been working here in Vancouver with a collective called Gesturing Towards Decolonial Futures. Some of you might know their writings. It's led by Dr. Vanessa Andreotti, who's actually moved from U B C to University of Victoria, where she's the Dean of Education. And she wrote a book called Hospicing Modernity. Some of you might have read it, and if you haven't, I, I recommend it.
And I just want to acknowledge that that work on decolonization has been deeply influential. It changed my life in terms of how I learn and how I unlearn. And the unlearning part is really important. It's also interesting that I'm here in Vancouver. I'm here visiting and supporting family… This is the home of the World Soundscape Project from the 1970s, of course, which is very influential in the field of acoustic ecology. And what's happening now is that a lot of the assumptions of Murray Schafer in the World Soundscape Project are being questioned, in a good way, in terms of what it means today to listen to the soundscape, what is urbanism, and what is natural sounds today in the context of decolonization, which is happening here in Canada. So that's something to think about : those historical relationships with place, like a place like Vancouver.
So what I'll do today is show you a few examples. Hopefully the technology will work, and if it doesn't, you can listen to it after on, on the podcast, show you a little bit of the work I've been doing. And then I'd love to have conversation. I know time is tight, but I really appreciate feedback and honest feedbacks. That's something I've learned from my colleagues in the GTDF collective, which is that there's this thing called brutally honest feedback, which is when you don't hold back. You don't insult the person, but you don't hold back saying what you really feel. And that way we can get to the bottom of issues and how people are responding. So that's something I try to do as respectfully as possible, but also brutally.
So just a few points of clarification. When I talk about modernity, I'm not talking about modernity in art, you know, not modern art.
I'm talking about modernity in the sense of extractive capitalism over consumption, of endless growth, systemic racism, white supremacy, our separation from nature, all of those issues that we're facing right now. So, it's a question of critiquing modernity, but also owning it in the sense of letting it go and trying to retain some elements like the technology we're using today. There are a lot of the tools that we've built in a way that can be truly sustainable and ethical. And I think that work is just beginning now. I don't think we really understand what that means to question modernity and how to exit this self-destructive lifestyle that we've created, which also has many, many benefits, right and yet is so destructive.
So, for example, at the end of my podcast, I always talk about how I'm grateful and accountable to the earth and human labor that provided me with the privilege of producing this podcast, including all the toxic materials and extractive processes behind the computers, recorders, transportations, and infrastructure that make this podcast possible.
So, what that means is that I try to recognize where things come from and my role in it: when I use my computer, who helped build it, which labor involved and so on. And what I try to do is, for instance, I didn't fly to Switzerland, though I could have, because the carbon footprint was too big and because I could do it by communications. Therefore, I did. I donate funds at the end of each podcast to different causes. I try to use green technologies, all that kind of thing. And I try also not to lecture anyoneabout what they should or shouldn't do. Rather, because I'm a listener, like all of you in this community, I try to participate in my home community and use that skill of listening to guide my work.
So I'll play the first example now. It's the very first episode. It's one I actually produced here in Vancouver, and it's called e101 tension : how do you feel now? You'll see in listening to it that it's an invitation to slow down, because one of the problems we have with modernity is that we're always rushing around in a mad kind of fury to get things done and to be productive. But, but if we slow down and if we listen differently, we might have a different experience. We might use other senses of our body and new ways that open up untapped potential. Not through just our ears, but our body. So, let's see if this works to play the sound here. …
(sound does not work)
Oh, well then, that's fine.Let's just call that an example because, uh, it's not so important to listen to it together. Now you get an idea, I'm talking in a slow voice, there are field recordings and musical sounds, etc. Every episode is something like that. There is material, it could be a field recording, it could be an interview and then I will process and work with an idea so that it becomes a five-minute thought or experience. And, and so I've done many of those. If you're interested, just go to the podcast and you can listen. My point is here that I got some interesting feedback from listeners. And I'll give you an example from a colleague who took a course with me called Facing Human Wrongs.
Here is a quick example of the kind of feedback I got: ‘Episode 1 (e101) was a great start and stirring for me. I wanted it to last longer (even though my answer to your question was that I felt restless and annoyed). The gift of silence and breathing throughout and especially towards the end are so much appreciated. I am curious if these silences appear in the middle, how much are we conditioned not to trust the silence/devices and to sway towards checking our phones/devices to see whether the soundtrack stopped or is still playing. This can be an episode by itself.’
I thought that was very interesting insight, and I constantly got feedback from listeners saying, uyou know, what about this or why are you doing that, have you read this article or giving me feedback? And so, for example, one episode was about how we can demodernize art. One was about a heat pump that I set up in our house, and what does decarbonization sound like? I had an episode with an indigenous artist,France Trépanier, who asked about, what does a small moment in a much larger space sound like? So, the idea of time in the indigenous world being much, much longer than in the colonial world that we have here in Canada.
So that's, that's the project. I was going to play to you for you an excerpt from episode 112 listening, because it's not necessary but I'll just tell you a little bit about it. I had the privilege of being a keynote at the World Forum for Acoustic Ecology in Florida in March. And along with a couple of other artists, and I did a 12 minute episode. I broke my own rule. It was supposed to be only five minutes, but this one was 12. And the, I came up with five conclusions, and I'll read them to you so that you understand what I was trying to say at the time. The first is face reality and learn how to unlearn. The second is develop and implement a radical theory of change through the arts.
The third is transition out of modernity. The fourth is how to change the story. And the fifth is connect our efforts.
We've already talked a little bit about unlearning. To me, unlearning is letting go of the assumptions we have and the things that we take for granted. It’s really about starting afresh in terms of what is really happening in the world as opposed to what we've been taught and therefore the idea of using the arts more radically. I think the arts are really good at raising awareness of environment. I'm sure you've had lots of presentations on that, but how can the arts be more radical, be much more proactive in showing a vision of the world, and for artists to live that talk, to change their ways for us to relate to each other differently.
I also talk about transitioning out of modernity, of changing the story is what this session today is about, and what your whole conference is about : how can we, as listeners change the story.So that's, that's not easy, but that's an interesting one where the arts have tremendous potential.
And lastly, I talked about connecting our efforts. And this is one of our biggest challenges, is that we work in isolation and relative isolation. So, we work in little networks in Europe and North America and, and Asia, but how do we connect those efforts in the arts and culture and other areas so that we have a lot more momentum and impact? Because I'm not feeling momentum right now. I'm feeling that there's a type of complacency in the world around climate, the climate emergency, and the ecological crisis. We've survived, as best we could COVID. But now, um, we must get back to the work that was started, and that was in the works before it was interrupted by COVID and then be informed by COVID.
So it's a time of re-energizing. I think. I won't read you a, a quote that I was going to read you, because it's a bit long, but I had a many exchanges with Hildegard Westerkamp, who many of you will know from her work as a composer, as a sound walker and a theorist. She responded many times, and they're all on my website.
So if you're interested I've also done a monthly blog, where I summarize my learnings, and you can read those. In fact, the today's presentation I just published yesterday as a blog as well, so that there's discourse that you can learn from each other and realize that we are all questioning the same things.
What does it mean to have to unlearn? I talk about the notion of spiritual bypassing. These are concepts that are emerging out of scholarly work and I think are really interesting because they are empowering and are positive : questioning things that we are uncomfortable with but we need to work our way through.
So, halfway through the project, I did a 57-minute episode (e127 halfway). Some of you might know framework radioin Estonia. They're publishing the piece at the end of the month.
So I did a summary of everything that I had learned, and there's a quote in the blog that I published today about that, but I won't read it to you. And then I, I do want to tell you about a story because stories are so powerful here in Vancouver.
Some of you might know Dr. Dylan Robinson, who's the author of Hungry Listening. And if you don't know his work, I recommend you read that book because it talks about decolonized listening in a very, very powerful way. And I attended an event at the University of British Columbia where Dylan invited a number of artists to listen to Vancouver. And some of you might know that one of the projects of the Vancouver soundscape was, revisiting, the Vancouver Soundscape. And what Dylan did is asked a, a group of artists, mostly indigenous artists, to go into the field and to listen and to report back on what they heard. And what they talked about was how their bodies listened to haptic vibrations, how they were hearing and feeling the voices of non-human and the relationship with non-humans, how we can perceive infrastructure differently.
They also talked about the Transmountain pipeline and ghosts and feelings and reverberations. And what they didn't do is talk about themselves. They didn't talk about technology. They didn't talk about the World Soundscape project. They talked about what they experienced and how they relate to the sounds of Vancouver, which is very different from other readings. So, to me, this is an example of decolonized listening and unlearning. There I was sitting in a room with maybe 50 people in a session that was not recorded. We were just there listening to the testimony of listeners in a way that I thought was extremely powerful. So, I write about that in my work
I'll finish with an episode published this week called saturation and how it came about and you can listen to it.
It's the most recent episode on the podcast. And it, it came about from a collaborator of mine who who helped me develop the podcast. And I said, so, what do you think? How's it going? Says I can't listen to it. And I said, why? She said, because it's too difficult : my life is already full of climate emergency news. I just can't take it. And, and it made me feel so sad that we are so saturated with information, but also so many calls to action. How many calls to action can we do when we feel disempowered by the situation and the culture in which we live? You know, we need systemic change, and yet we feel not able to do that. So, that episode talks about that feeling of disempowerment and of feeling the saturation and how we can work through the saturation.
And one of the ways to work through saturation is to just slow down and to be much more judicious in what we listen to, and maybe just take in a little bit more of the difficult news and process it. So I really appreciated my colleague's feedback that she was just not able to process the podcast that she was working on with me. So, there’s at the end of each episode and this one was : how can we tap into what the boundless streams of love, connection and meaning? And that's drawn from a book, a book by Dr. Britt Wray, uh, who wrote a book called Generation Dread. And some of you might know it, it's about eco-anxiety, and she has a blog. She's very prolific and wonderful thinker and writer about eco-anxiety.
So, her conclusion is that if we tap into the boundless dream of love connection, meaning that we have inside of us, if we can work through our anxiety and work through our grief and work through our denial, quite frankly, then we have tremendous strength, tremendous energies that are untapped. So I'll leave it at that.
I want to thank all those who I've recorded, I hope I have done so ethically. Also, I got a grant from the Canada Council for the Arts for this project, and I'm very thankful that I was able to pay my collaborators and work in good conditions. I appreciate that you're doing this conference in Switzerland today and that you will continue to do discourse and have opportunities for exchange and to invite people like me to participate in your activities. So, I'll leave it at that and invite you to listen to the podcast whenever you wish. You can subscribe if you're interested and I'm happy if there's time for any questions.
Claude (voice over)
So, the first question that I was asked after my presentation was about the lack of diverse representation at the conference and issues of, of representation and different voices being heard or not heard so the question was mostly addressed to the organizers, but also to me, and to get my thoughts on the issue of who's not in the room, that kind of thing. Here's what I said.
Claude:
Well, of course, I can't speak on behalf of the organizers. They can respond, and I'm sure they will, and I'm sure they have. I'm sure they share your concerns, because often in conferences, you work with what is submitted, but you can also curate, right? So that's, that's the power you have, is to try to get as many submissions and then to fill the gaps. My own point of view on that is, is to be as inclusive as possible and to get out of the way when necessary. So sometimes I take up too much room I find. I've been pulling away and trying to pass the microphone to others. I do that with my podcast to have as many different voices as I can but also, for instance, I'm a founder of an organization called SCALE here in Canada, which is an art and climate organization.
And if you want to find it, it's easy to google scale art and climate. And that organization I just left because I had given what I had to give, and new voices were necessary. And so that's part of it: moving out when you're a privileged white male like me, but also to work with others and to be present without having to necessarily speak first or have your point of view heard You also have to search for information that might not be as easily as available. So, for instance, the work of the Gesturing Towards Decolonial Futures collective, I promote as much as I can because it's such brilliant work, and it is informed by indigenous points of view and afro futuristic points of view and many others. And, and I think as curators and as producers, it's incumbent us upon us to reflect the diversity around us.
And, and that diversity is here : it's in Europe, it's in North America and is everywhere. And to be as proactive and as radical as you canin your programming and I think your point is well taken also in terms of cross sectoral representation. So, you're an anthropologist. It's really interesting to have other people here, and I commend you for coming to the conference, to hear from other fields of expertise and to have that kind of dialogue. And I know that's happening in acoustic ecology. In fact, acoustic ecology. One of its great strengths, of Murray Schaffer and others, is that it was transdisciplinary from the beginning. It touched all fields, even though it was driven by artists and continues to this day to be very cross-sectoral. But what it isn't as diverse as it could be because there are dominant voices. There are people in institutions who have a point of view and have a power base. They have the money to come to conferences. So that's part of the challenge as well: economic access. But I think your point is well taken and, and we should continue to work on it and at future events do better.
Claude (voice over)
And the second question was about listening itself. Is listening enough to address ecological issues like the ecological crisis, or do we need to have different kinds of new forms of listening to address the complexities that we face? That was essentially the question, and here is my answer.
Claude
Well, that's a big question. It's probably the existential question of any acoustic ecologist: how do you position listening? Certainly, listening in and of itself is an act of receiving, therefore, of processing. So, you know, it has the potential to be whatever the listener accepts in the environment. But I think it can't just be listening. I think it must be ecological listening. It must be social listening. It must be justice listening. There's many, many forms of listening that we do intuitively, but I don't think we've developed a canon of listening enough yet.I think your question is good, because listening in and of itself, Hildegard Westerkamp would agree is good but, but the forms of listening and the position of listening is the question now: what baggage, what assumptions do we have in our listening? How can we change those? And how can listening evolve not just with our ears, but with our body and our minds and all that. So that's a quick answer to a big question. And one, I invite you all to consider from your different points of view and to talk about, constantly talk about listening, experiment, do sound walks, do everything you can to enhance that sense of listening and its connection to our environment.